How do you cope?

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How do you cope?

Postby CO_RedRocker » Sun Nov 21, 2010 8:48 pm

So I made a lot of enemies it seems with my attitude, fine, whatever. So no one ever answered this question. How do I cope with the fact that our chances of finding another masculine dude we click with seems to be slim to none?

I'm sorry, I'm too much of a realist to be optimistic in the face of certain failure. Yeah, I know, if you think like a defeatist from the outset, you are likely to fail. Fine, I get that, so some of you think optimistically and ignore the high likelihood of failure. My question is HOW do you do that?

It might help you to understand my personality better, and I think the poster Rico is going to know where I'm coming from on this being another INTJ. We are logical people based on facts and reason, not hopes, dreams, ideals, or anything abstract like that. For an idea of what I'm like, think the Vulcans (like Spock) from Star Trek. I know one of my biggest problems is that I'm a black and white thinker, but sorry, that's not going to change. I'm an all or nothing kind of guy. I'm intense, like my cousin tells me. I have a strong passion for everything I do and every situation I face, both good and bad. For the more timid, this puts them off and scares them away, and I'm used to that. I don't have timid friends for that reason.

So anyway, back to the main point, for some of you it seems to come much easier to somehow trudge out there everyday with a smile on your face even though you woke up alone, you keep your head up and hope that maybe, just maybe, today will be the day you meet that Mr. Right. You go to work, run your errands, come home and sit down in front of the TV until you're so sleepy you can't stay up anymore, then you crawl into bed, alone, and fall asleep with nothing to cuddle but a pillow or maybe a pet. How does living that life day in and day out not become soul crushingly depressing? How is it that you can somehow maintain a positive outlook and attitude and be optimistic when it seems from all the facts and rationality that you will end up alone unless you change your standards and just go for whatever you can get?

That's what I don't understand, that's one of the few things in life I have yet to accomplish, and that's something that no one has been willing to teach me yet.

So I don't know, does it take drugs? Does it take avoiding the facts in front of you? Does it take tricking your mind into thinking that the world is rainbows and sunshine despite reality to the contrary? I just don't understand how something like that is possible to accomplish without somehow altering my brain chemistry through chemical means so that I am blind to reality and live in a blissful ignorance of just how unlikely it will be that I find "the one" I can click with.

Let's be realistic, unless we are obviously gay, it's not easy to tell another dude into dudes. Even if he is, there's no guarantee that you're his type anyway. Let's assume that by some freak chance you do find a dude you click with that's into you, what are the chances he also wants something long term?

I'm going to throw out some numbers out there, they are probably not 100% accurate, but they give you an idea of how my brain works on this:

The percentage of the male population that is into dudes/willing to date a dude 1.5% (This assumes that 3% of the total population is homosexual. A conservative estimate, but probably closer than the 10% Kinseyian estimate from the last century) Assuming we have about 320 Million people, that means that 4,800,000 people in the US are gay males. Subtract out those under the age of 18 (roughly half the population) and that leaves 2,400,000 gay males. Let's assume that one third of that population are between the ages of 18 and 35 (my dating range), that means that there are 800,000 males available to date. Now in that figure, just based on my personal observations, let's assume that one third is truly masculine (voice, mannerisms, interests, style of dress), with the other two thirds effeminate and in between respectively. This leaves 266,666 males available. Now in that population, the current obesity rate is roughly a quarter, let's assume that gay men are a little healthier (since we are superficial) and that the rate is around 18% instead, that means there are still about 218,666 gay men available to date. Let's assume I'm not attractive to a third of that population, that leaves 145,777 left. Let's assume that half are currently in a relationship of some kind or otherwise unavailable to date, that leaves 72,888 men. I'm not gonna discuss race factors, because frankly at this point, I'm open to any race, but of that amount, based on the current population breakdown, roughly 51,000 would be white, 14,577 would be black, and the remaining 7288 would be other categories (Asians, other Caucasians, Native Americans, Mixed, etc). Approximately 11,000 of the total would be Hispanic. Now what percentage of that amount do you think are ready for an LTR (not just looking for one, but honestly ready for one)? Should we assume maybe a quarter or a third? If it's a quarter, that means there are 18,222 masculine gay guys between 18-35 who are ready to date and who we're each others types. If it's a third, that's 24,296.

So after all that, in the ENTIRE United States, there are roughly 18,222/24,296 masculine gay men between the ages of 18 and 35 available to date, ready to date, and who we fit each others types. Now the question must be asked, where the heck are they and how do I bag one :P

Look, I know I come off dark and pessimistic, like I said, it's just the way I'm wired. But if someone can tell me HOW I can ignore these facts and pretend that reality doesn't exist and to somehow go out each day optimistic even though I fall asleep and wake up alone, I would love to know how to accomplish that.

Sorry for the long post, just want to get this out there.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby Ashpenaz » Sun Nov 21, 2010 11:54 pm

Everyone important I've met in my life I've my by doing what I do, wherever I am. Though I haven't met Mr. Right, I've had a lot of great experiences and friendships just living life, and I'm extremely grateful for those. To be honest, and this is simply my solution, is that I have learned, as a recovering alcoholic, that the only way good things are going to come into my life is if I trust God. Again, that's just me, and I'm not pushing any religion or form of spirituality. Sobriety means more than just keeping away from substances--it's a state of mind where I am clean and prepared for whatever good God wants to send my way. Because, as you point out, the odds are stacked against all of us.

I enjoy your attitude, RR. I like your straightforwardness and honesty. I just don't necessarily agree with your pessimism. Here's a response from an intuitive/creative:

Some enchanted evening, you may see a stranger
you may see a stranger across a crowded room,
and somehow you know, you know even then,
that somewhere you'll see him again and again!

Some enchanted evening, someone may be laughing
you may hear him laughing across a crowded room,
and night after night as strange as it seems
the sound of his laughter will sing in your dreams!

Who can explain it, who can tell you why,
fools give you reasons, wise men never try!

Some enchanted evening, when you find your true love
when you hear him call you across a crowded room,
then fly to his side and make him your own
or all thru your life you may dream all alone!

Once you have found him,
never let him go!

Once you have found him,
never let him go!

Music by Richard Rodgers
with lyrics by Oscar Hammerstein II, 1949
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby CO_RedRocker » Mon Nov 22, 2010 7:59 am

OK, again, I read "Think Positive". I get that's what I'm supposed to do, but HOW? Basically, when people tell me "think positive", it's like they are telling me to drive to BFE without giving me directions.

Again, I'm expected to forget my past and ignore reality, but that's not the easiest thing in the world for me to do.

I'm starting to think I must really be screwed up since this seems to be something that comes really easy to everyone else and I never figured out how to flip that switch. Is this like breathing to the rest of the world? You know, something so easy and natural that they can't really explain how to do it, and me asking it seems ridiculous because it's something that should come naturally?
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby Ashpenaz » Mon Nov 22, 2010 8:50 am

I'm not sure the best paraphrase is "Think positive." What I'm trying to do, and I recognize that this is one of those cliches' you find in recovery, is "Let Go and Let God." I'm not trying to define God for anyone. But I like to believe that whatever runs the Universe knows what I need and will send me the people and relationships which are healthy for me. Because the odds are so stacked against me, I'm never going to be able to find anyone on my own. So, I have to trust that if I remain open and ready, the relationships which I'm meant to have will be sent my way.

I'm jealous of straight guys for many reasons, but one of them is the fact that every straight guy has millions and millions of women to choose from and he can have sex more often with more people than I can. I'm like you, RR. I like a certain kind of masculine guy who isn't typically gay. I've never met a guy in my whole life who is the kind of masculine I find attractive and who is also open to gay sex or a gay relationship. I've seen pictures and videos, though! :oops: So they must be out there somewhere, and if I'm open and ready, one (or two or several) will cross my path. Since it's only been about a month since I've fully accepted the fact that gay sex sounds fun, I imagine it will be awhile until I am given a chance to explore it.

Again, I agree with your assessment of the situation for those of us gays whose primary identification is masculine. We don't have a lot to choose from. But I believe that Someone is on our side, helping us find each other.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby Phoenix6570 » Mon Nov 22, 2010 2:33 pm

I understand how you feel; I too share the same thoughts. Most of the time I feel like I'll end up alone hoping to find that special someone. I'm overweight so I feel like my chances of meeting someone decrease even more. Its a rough world out there and I agree it isn't always easy for gay men.

The only real advice I can offer is to try to and focus on other things. It really won't do you any good to be depressed regarding your situation. I suggest trying to improve yourself in a variety of ways that way at least you have a lot to bring to the table if you do meet a guy. Also start going out more and doing things to have fun. That way you don't feel like you need a partner to enjoy life.

There will be times that you'll be upset; allow yourself to feel that way but don't make it your primary focus. When you're sad be sad but when you're feeling happy make the most of it. Only time will tell if you meet a guy that you click with, so in the mean time do things to fill your time that have a positive impact on your life.
"As long as a person doesn't admit he's defeated, he is not defeated-- he's just a little behind, and isn't through fighting" ~ Darrel Royal
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby olywaguy » Tue Nov 23, 2010 8:19 pm

First of all, welcome to the board CRR. I hope you find the Butch Board a place that you can come to for questions and answers...that is how I found this website.

I was 38 years old when I realized what was my gender preference. Growing up, when it came to dating, I was horribly shy. I could never approach a girl. I also never felt the way a guy was supposed to feel about a girl. A lot of my friends would get very excited for a girl and, though they were okay, I never really felt that way. I had respect for them but that was pretty much it. I never knew why that was. So, I never went on a date during my teenage years. College came and it was still the same. I do remember noticing this one guy outside my dorm who had an amazing body playing frisbee with his friends. I remember thinking "wow, I wish i looked like that" and feeling excited about that. I also didn't think anybody liked me in a sexual manner. No one ever really approached me in that way...or if they ever did, it was someone I wasn't interested in. Also, as a Christian and a preacher's kid, I wanted to wait until marriage before I would get intimate with someone. Time passed...and nothing...till I moved to Washington State.

I don't know how long after I moved here it happened...all of a sudden (or maybe because I was so far away from my family) I started having feelings for guys...especially the ones that worked at the Safeway around the corner. :P I started having dreams about guys...at first with girls in the pictures but eventually girls ceased to show up and it was only guys. I started having these feelings and felt confused...I wondered how come I was having these feelings (of course, these were feelings that had been buried deep inside of me for so many years) but, to me it felt sudden. So, I tried to find answers...went on the Internet and found this place...the Butch Board. The guys were really nice and friendly...very helpful and willing to answer my questions.

Then, I met this 19 year old guy via AOL chat. We would chat at times but he always pursued me. He wanted to hook up and I would put him off and tell him no. Then, I turned 40 years old (that was seven years ago) and had the opportunity to meet some of the guys from the Butch Board at a Vegas reunion. For the first time in my life I was in an environment that was all gay. It was also the first time I went to a gay bar. Nice bunch of guys here. Upon my return to Olympia, the 19 year old once again asked me to hook up with him and, though still a little reluctant, I said yeah. So, I picked him up and brought him to my place. Goodness, I felt so nervous. I was literally trembling. He wanted to take a shower and asked me to join him. At first, I was reluctant but said "what the heck" and joined him in the shower....that was nice. :) :D To this day, it is one of my favorite things to do with a guy. I am surprised by how many guys have never done that before. I remember feeling so nervous and sometimes when he touched me, I felt ticklish. I wasn't used to anyone touching me in an intimate manner...that was the first time anyone had done that to me. But, what I remember the most was the way I felt when I kissed him. For some reason, it felt right and not strange at all...it felt natural to me. From that point on, I knew who I was. It took me a while to feel comfortable flirting with guys and going out with guys.

One of the things that challenges me on a daily basis is "how can I be both gay and a Christian at the same time?" But, there it is. God is perfect. Why would he put those feelings in me if they were wrong. He doesn't make mistakes. If he wanted everyone to be straight then why put those feelings there in the first place? Nonetheless, that is a challenge I live with in a daily basis.

People who know me tend to see me as an optimist. My student workers tend to be kind of cynical as well and have a sort of pessimist attitude as well. It is not unusual to get into a deep discussion with them about things. Recently, one of my student workers took my advice about her not giving up on a club she had just recently established on campus. At first, she got this great reaction for it. She asked them on what day and time they should meet and she set it up accordingly. However, since then, only a handful of people show up. She was ready to give up because it didn't go the way she expected. I told her not to give up and to give it some time. It takes time to get a club going. Since then, she has created a facebook page for the club and has decided to follow my advice and continue to give the club a chance.

Since I work at a college library, I have the opportunity to be around a lot of young people. I notice (maybe due to the internet) that young people are impatient and want immediate satisfaction...they want instant results. Afterall, if the internet can do that why can't real life? Well, it doesn't work quit that way. God has three answers to prayer: 1) Yes 2) No 3) Wait. The last one is the toughest one of them all. It is the way God tests you. He wants to see if you trust in HIm to take care of things for you...like someone said here "let go, let God" take care of things for you.

Let me give you an example of wait. After I graduated from college, I was anxious to find my first permanent professional job. I graduated with a B.A in American history. What am I going to do with this degree? So, for a couple of years, I tried my best to find jobs elsewhere but no matter where I applied nothing popped up. So, I decided to go back to school and get a teaching certificate to teach high school social studies. I was attending Louisiana State University in Baton Rouge at the time so I was going for certification in the state of Louisiana. I did that. Got certification but still had a hard time find a straight social studies job. All the social studies jobs available wanted for me to do coaching as well and I have never coached anything in my life. I felt very frustrated. I managed to find substitute teaching jobs at private schools around the city. I wondered why was I still here.

Well, one thing you need to know is that many years ago before my dad had lost both of his kidneys and so was in dialysis. For many years, dad had gone through this process. His doctor was in New Orleans so he, my mom, and my younger sister would make the trip from northeast Mississippi (an 8 hour car drive) to N.O. On one of these trips, their appointment with the doctor was on my 30th birthday. So, I was to meet them there after I was done with a class (I went back to school to get teaching certificates in English, speech, and something else I cannot remember at the moment). I was taking a short story writing class and after that class, I got some things packed and made my way to New Orleans to meet them. I found them at X-Ray. My mom looked tired as well as my dad. Mom asked me to accompany dad to X-ray. Dad wasn't looking too well. The doctor had asked him to check into the hospital right away. Dad was reluctant because he wanted to take me to a Chinese restaurant (my favorite) for my birthday, but the doctor insisted.
Dad returned to his hospital room. He hadn't gotten any sleep in a very long time and the doctors gave him something to make him sleep. So, my mom and I returned to our room. Mom was worried. We celebrated my 30th birthday with a pizza in our room. I left the next morning for Baton Rouge. I didn't say goodbye to my dad because he was asleep and he needed it. A few days later...on a Saturday, I got a call from my older sister telling me that dad wasn't doing too well and that I needed to get to New Orleans right away. Both of my sisters were in Mississippi and they would make the trip to New Orleans. I got the call at about 5 am or so, from her tone it seemed like it was dad's time to go. The only thing I took with me was an address book in case I needed to make some calls. My thought throughout the drive was "please don't let him die before I get there."
Dad held on until Sunday evening. The whole family was there when he died. He died five days after my 30th birthday.

A verse from Psalm 30:5 comforted me a great deal during this time:

For his anger endureth but a moment; in his favor is life: weeping may endure for a night, but joy cometh in the morning.

Not only after dad's passing, I managed to get my first professional job at the library at LSU. Worked there for three years until I moved back home to Mississippi and commuted for three years to my job at Ole Miss. I mainly returned home to be a help to my mom and my younger sister after dad's passing. An opportunity arose to be head of government documents here in Olympia and I took the job after talking it over with mom and your sis and I had their full support. I will be celebrating 12 years in January at my current job.

In order to see hope and optimism, you have to go through turmoil. You appreciate the joy more after going through great sadness. You can't have the one if you don't have the other. Hope and optimism cannot be taught...it has to be experienced.
Carlos

"I just want to suck his tongue out of his mouth !"--JPaul


http://www.askcarlos.com/
http://carlos-the-critic.blogspot.com/
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby JakeMIke » Wed Nov 24, 2010 8:43 am

Hey, another INTJ here. Until I found out about the Myers-Briggs test I thought I was pretty much alone in the world. Now I know that there are a very small minority of people in the world like me, and the reasons why.

I too have been alone for all of my life (I'm 53). How do I do it? I really don't know, but every day I try to find pleasure from other sources, like books, music, movies, etc. I do like people but they don't really understand me at all. All I can say is that you should try to focus on self-improvement and making friends, as hard as the latter part can be. I can't promise you'll end up with someone special to hold and love, but at least you can be open to the experience. I realize that I may never meet anyone that will become more than a friend to me, but I can't force relationships. Live for yourself is what I guess i am saying, not for other people.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby CO_RedRocker » Thu Nov 25, 2010 7:20 pm

Live for yourself is what I guess i am saying, not for other people.


Yeah, I'm quickly realizing that I can't really rely on others, can't count on them to be friends, and can't really trust or develop any kind of deep lasting relationship with them, be it simply friends or something more. My problem is finding stuff I enjoy doing by myself. Right now, it's the gym or video games, and both get boring after a few hours to where I'm just bored again and wish I had someone to hang out with or talk to. But I have to accept that people don't really want to be my friend, for various reasons, and it bums me out.

Then some people don't want to be friends with someone always bummed out, and I get caught in that catch 22 where I can't really do anything other than fake who I am, hide how I feel, and pretend everything is fantastic just to please others. I can't sincerely or convincingly do that, so I have to come up with more things to just do alone, and accept that I will be alone in my life, and fine, so be it.

My NPD (Narcissistic Personality Disorder) will likely get worse, but oh well, helps me cope looking down on those who are beneath me, who turn their back on me, and who I'm not "good enough" to hang out with them. I will be a loner, a sole voice, a wanderer in the wilderness then. I've just been toying with myself and my emotions thinking that I could really have friends anyway, my standards and expectations are way too high for people to be my friend:

1. No flaking, return calls
2. You invite me out sometimes to do stuff
3. Be honest if something is up and let me know

I realize now I was asking WAY too much of people in an age where everyone views friends like Facebook friends, someone that you add to your friends list with a click, never talk to again, and remove later when you can't remember who they are or why you added them.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby Ashpenaz » Thu Nov 25, 2010 8:16 pm

Once again, I can really, really relate to what you're saying RR. I have a very good straight friend, but just recently, we had a sort of mini-argument where I asked him to return my calls so I didn't feel like I was Fatal Attraction having to leave too many messages. His response was something like this: "I don't feel I have to return calls when we're just going to see each other in a couple of days anyway." I think the problem is he has a secure attachment style and I have an insecure attachment style. I assume that when people leave, they're never coming back. He can be away from people for a long time and not worry about the relationship disappearing. So, I try to leave just one message and not deal with the lack of callback.

He also never asks me to do stuff. Again, we had sort of a mini-argument where he did something with some other people, and it was something I was interested in. I assumed he knew I'd be interested and he should have asked me. His response was something like this: "It wasn't about you. It wasn't a question of not asking you, it's just that not everything I do includes you." So, again, he can move among a wide circle of friends, and I tend to attach to a single person and hang on for life.

Sometimes I sense him being hostile or upset, but he doesn't talk about it. So, he never lets me know if something is up or not.

The thing is, he's probably a normal straight guy. I am masculine and all that, but to some degree, my being gay means I have emotions that straights don't experience as deeply. I know he loves me as a friend, but for him, that doesn't mean calling me or including me in everything. It means that we hang out when we hang out. And I have to accept that, for most straights, that's what friendship, even deep friendship, is. It's not about satisfying some deep inner longing.

Once, when I was dating a girl who I was thinking of marrying, she said something like this: "I have a huge black hole of need which only you can fill." We broke up. I don't think relationships can work like that. What I like about being gay is that a relationship is about two independent men who CHOOSE to be in each other's lives. In my ideal relationship, we don't cling to each other or fill each other's emotional black holes--we have two independent lives and we meet in order to give each other support--and sex.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby CO_RedRocker » Fri Nov 26, 2010 12:23 am

Well, I'm a pretty black and white thinker. And like the straight guy that doesn't put a lot of effort into a friendship, when I begin to feel there is really nothing quality there, I move on, with or without notifying them as such. So when I'm trying to be someone's friend, I put in the effort, call them up, invite them to do stuff, etc. But when I feel like it's going no where and it's a one way street, I drop it and move on, kind of part of being an INTJ too. I do dwell on it, particularly if I'm left wondering "why" as in "why doesn't this dude want to hang out with me?" That's more a logical rather than emotional response, as in I don't really care about their feelings or thoughts as to why they didn't want to be friends, I want to know specifically if there was something I should have done differently so I know better for the future.

And I've been through that enough at this point in my life that my NPD just takes over and says, "I intimidated them, they couldn't handle the fact that I was above them/better than them" Frankly, I like that point of view so long as I'm not getting a valid response from them, why should I take it personal? It's their problem not mine that they were incapable of being my friend or incapable of telling me why they don't want to be friends. I really have no desire to torture it out of someone what their beef with me is, I ask once, and if they can't give me an answer, I move on and write them off. That, of course, leaves me with very few friends, but the ones that remain I consider very high quality. So if that has to be my approach/style and I'm left with one or two quality friends versus a couple dozen so-so friends, I think I'm better off that way anyway.

Besides, let's be honest, the only value I have to a gay dude is my sex appeal. If I'm hot enough then they are willing to be my friend. That's why I have only two gay friends at this point. Attraction isn't a valid basis for a platonic relationship. Though I admit at this point I'm trying to find attractive bisexual friends who I hope can help me get some chicks so I can start to go that route. I'll hang out with anyone I click with, but I am pretty myopic and superficial when it comes to that goal (as I assume that the women will be as well) so a less attractive bisexual friend won't be a lot of help getting me a decent/attractive looking chick.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby PhillyAgenda » Fri Nov 26, 2010 1:10 am

I'm definitely not avoiding the reality of the situation or trying to trick myself into believing everything is peachy. I guess I'm just trying to get through this without losing my mind. I'm constantly reminded of just how difficult it is to find someone I can be close to. I agree one of the biggest problems is masculine gay guys not being able to identify each other. We're all mistaking each other for straight guys. I guess being gay and masculine pretty much requires you to become an expert on picking up signals, noticing eye contact and reading between the lines of small comments and all that crap just to find out if a guy is into other guys. It's tiring and ridiculous and I still haven't figured it all out but honestly I'm not sure what else to do.

And then there are the guys who are dating women and just want to sneak around with guys on the side. You can't do anything with that. So yeah I understand that the number of potential partners for us is pretty small, and yes that is a problem. Coping with these things, I'm not sure I can explain how I do that. I just try not to obsess over it and take advantage of any opportunities when they present themselves. I'm not an outgoing person at all so at this point I really can't afford to ignore any possible signs that a guy I like might be into me. I meet a guy I'm attracted to I'm gonna try to get to know him as best I can. If there is something mutual there, I think it will show itself sooner or later.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby Ashpenaz » Fri Nov 26, 2010 11:07 am

Actually, I'm attractive to women, so if that's the kind of friend you want, I'm your wing man, RR. I may not be physically attractive to gays, being older and overweight (see who I look like in another thread), but women like me because I'm funny and smart and I give the impression of being nurturing. Over the past couple of years, I've had all kinds of chances to have sex with women. I just don't like women. There's a line from the movie As Good As It Gets where someone asks Jack Nicholson how he writes such good female characters. He says, "I just write about a man and subtract reason and accountablity." That's my experience with women. If you want to put up with that just have sex, more power to you, but the sex just isn't a big enough payoff to me if I have to deal with what a woman dishes out.

Also, RR--if my experience is anything to go by, I think that a lot of these men you talk about are your friends, but because they're straight, they don't call other guys and they don't make times to meet. Honestly, straight guys mostly just assume they're going to see each other around. You make friends by being at the gym at the same time every day, for instance. If a guy is there when you're there, that guy is being friends with you. It's not the way gay men relate, but gays are a drag to be friends with most of the time since they are all-consuming when it comes to friendship.

PA, I've often wondered what I'd do if I met a guy who wanted to see me on the down low. Would I be desperate enough to go for it? Probably, if it was Jason Statham. I wish I could say I had values, but to quote Lily Tomlin, it only looks like I have integrity because nobody's buying. :?
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby Rico » Sun Nov 28, 2010 6:34 pm

CO_RedRocker wrote:...Look, I know I come off dark and pessimistic, like I said, it's just the way I'm wired. But if someone can tell me HOW I can ignore these facts and pretend that reality doesn't exist and to somehow go out each day optimistic even though I fall asleep and wake up alone, I would love to know how to accomplish that...


If you're real, then this is the best advice you will ever get: “Stop trying to find ‘The One’, and be ‘The One’”.

Stop trying to find that special someone, stop searching so desperately. You’re looking outwardly which is your biggest mistake. Take a step back and look in the mirror. What do you see? Would you date yourself? If not, then get a clue and maybe start there.

Guys in this place are willing to help you with that, but that's only if you're willing, and of course, if you're real.
In the Beginning there was nothing, and God said: 'Let there be Light." There was still nothing, but you could see it.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby JakeMIke » Mon Nov 29, 2010 2:52 pm

I second Rico's comments. Work on yourself and don't worry about others so much.

BTW, are you in therapy for NPD? Who gave you that diagnosis, if you don't mind my asking?
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby CO_RedRocker » Mon Dec 06, 2010 9:07 pm

Well I will be working on myself as I believe through my research and study that my attraction to dudes stems from my low self esteem. I don't so much as want to be intimate with a dude as I do want to BE them. That's been a major issue for about 2.5 decades now. So I'm seeing a hypnotist now to help me boost my confidence, and I gotta admit, so far it's been a big change. I still have some self doubts and still compare myself to others negatively, but last weekend I went out to the bars with my friends, hit up a couple of groups of girls, which was a hell of a lot more than I've done before, especially being an INTJ who generally avoids social settings. My roommate complimented me after and said he thought I did really well, a lot of improvement. And keep in mind that was only after one hypnosis session. I expect when all 6 are done, I'll be well on my way to being beyond the need to get with other dudes to feel better about myself.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby nimby » Mon Dec 06, 2010 10:00 pm

Ok, so I'm confused, Are you saying that you are gay cause it's the path of least resistance?
"Why do we have asteroids in the hemisphere and hemmorroids in the a$$ ? "
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby CO_RedRocker » Mon Dec 06, 2010 10:37 pm

nimby wrote:Ok, so I'm confused, Are you saying that you are gay cause it's the path of least resistance?


More or less, yes. It's all I've known in my life thus far, but I'm not so complacent as to think that it's impossible for me to try something different. But let's be honest, guys are easy, sexually, and to an extent, women are too more and more in our society. My problem is never having dealt with women before in the "dating game" but I know how guys work. If you're "hot" enough (or just go for someone less attractive than you) invite them over, pop in a movie, and a few minutes later start making out, whip out your cocks, and get to it. No real challenge or skill involved in that.

Now that said, guys in general are commitment-phobic, it's just in our nature. So I don't expect to actually date another dude for anything longer than until the next "hot" guy comes along that shows one of us attention. I could potentially have an "open" relationship where we are "together", but not really other than for appearance sake.

So yes, from where I stand and based on my life experiences thus far, "dating" guys is pretty damn easy. I expect it will be easy with girls too once I figure them out. And from what my bi friends tell me, there's really not much difference between gay guys and chicks mentally or emotionally speaking, so should be less of a challenge than I first anticipated.
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby J » Wed Dec 22, 2010 3:54 am

Trust me, there's a lot of masculine gay dudes out there, having lived in San Diego a number of years, I met a lot of hot military guys you'd never guess about.

I had to respond because you sound like me in a lot of ways (except you have narcisistic personality disorder and I have borderline personality disorder). And hell, I'd probably do you in a second and want to actually know you since we both have the "black and white" mentality and are both somewhat defeatist in our thinking.

I'm probably too old for you (I'm almost 31). Oh well. I don't think I act like a girl and never use the "F" (fa------) word, and have never lisped or "queened out".

And you're in CO and I'm in MA. Sucks!
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Re: How do you cope?

Postby Davy » Wed May 11, 2011 9:28 pm

CRR, I'm almost an INTJ. I'm an INTP, which is a very subtle difference. You like to have things planned out. I take things as they come.

J, CO may be closer to MA, but you already have a ticket to AK :D
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