Looking for books to help me deprogram

Discussion on what it means to be straight acting, whether it's good, bad or indifferent.

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Looking for books to help me deprogram

Postby variant » Sun Dec 28, 2008 12:06 am

Hey guys, I don't come here all too often but I felt I should as I am beginning the process of re-calibrating my' mind and absorbing postitive, constructive information. Practical knowlege in the vein of dealing with shame, ridicule, homophobia and such. Alot of this sort of thing really hurts me sometimes, to the point that it has hindered several areas of needed growth in my' life. I live in a small town so that hasn't aided me in gaining the kind of perspective I need in order to move forward to a place that offers more than paranoia, dysphoria, self-loathing etc.

I'm looking for very good books to read on subjects which will help me to gain a healthy self-concept and provide me with positive alternatives to victimhood, anger etc. So if you guys have several suggestions I would LOVE to hear about them.


I have:
the velvet rage by alan downs
Sissyphobia
Androphilia "it'll be here next week."

Books on natural masculinity have my' interest especially as of late.

Thanks.
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Postby masculinity » Sun Dec 28, 2008 1:56 am

These are some of the other sites:

Natural Manhood: a series of articles on natural manhood and sexuality

Masculinity for boys: A guide for peer educators; published by UNESCO, New Delhi

Non-westernized concepts of male sexuality Wikipedia article
Gays are a different species altogether from men (and women). They're not "men who like men," they are "third gender who like men."

http://youth-masculinity.blogspot.com
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Postby variant » Mon Dec 29, 2008 1:02 am

Thanks man.

Any more?
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Postby cloudy » Sat Feb 07, 2009 6:38 pm

The Road Less Traveled by Scott Peck MD

How to Win Friends and influence people
by Dale Carnegie

Scroll down the ButchBoard for hyperlinks to all kinds of interesting health and gay education stuff.


Cloudy a.k.a. Butch

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Cloudy, how much of a girl are you?

Postby Desperate » Sat Feb 07, 2009 11:58 pm

cloudy wrote:The Road Less Traveled by Scott Peck MD

How to Win Friends and influence people
by Dale Carnegie

Scroll down the ButchBoard for hyperlinks to all kinds of interesting health and gay education stuff.


Cloudy a.k.a. Butch

http://ButchBoard.com

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D



Cloudy, you look a little bit gay! GAY, LIKE AS IN FEMININE!
Being gay means being feminine!
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Postby Daknee » Sun Feb 08, 2009 10:26 am

The Power of the Subconcious Mind By Dr. Joseph Murphy
Beyond the Winning Streak By Lynda Madden Dahl
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Re: Cloudy, how much of a girl are you?

Postby cloudy » Mon Feb 09, 2009 1:49 am

Desperate wrote:
cloudy wrote:The Road Less Traveled by Scott Peck MD

How to Win Friends and influence people
by Dale Carnegie

Scroll down the ButchBoard for hyperlinks to all kinds of interesting health and gay education stuff.


Cloudy a.k.a. Butch

http://ButchBoard.com

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D



Cloudy, you look a little bit gay! GAY, LIKE AS IN FEMININE!



Not sure how I'm supposed to take that. Butch can take a hit. Can you?
Only a fool would mess with me physically. Don't try.
I'm 6'3, 210 and a very mean machine when I'm pissed off.

me, today...

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my place, today... sunday, feb 8/09
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Visit me at my homepage http://ButchBoard.com

or my other main site http://TheShapeOfGod.com

yes, I wrote a book.

or my other site http://ButchRadio.com

and I could go on and on
"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go"
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Re: Cloudy, how much of a girl are you?

Postby masculinity » Thu Feb 12, 2009 1:58 pm

cloudy wrote:Not sure how I'm supposed to take that. Butch can take a hit. Can you?
Only a fool would mess with me physically. Don't try.
I'm 6'3, 210 and a very mean machine when I'm pissed off.


You're known by the identity you keep... and if you say you're gay, then you can't be a man. It's as simple as that.

Even some women are strong physically -- does that make them a 'man'? No.

Queer/ effeminate males can be strong but they are still not men. Only masculine gendered males are men. And masculine gendered males don't go about calling themselves 'gay' so proudly and with such comfort.
Gays are a different species altogether from men (and women). They're not "men who like men," they are "third gender who like men."

http://youth-masculinity.blogspot.com
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Postby cloudy » Fri Feb 13, 2009 7:19 pm

Which is, I guess, why I'm so very, very, very reclusive.

And the 2 closest friends I have are women. My male friends are all straight, but they know I'm gay.

Seems to work for me.

You have to be pretty fast to keep my company.

I don't really grasp why anyone who identifies with the concept that a gay man must be, somehow, ladylike, to be gay would find any interest in this site, in the first place.

If such female identifying types like this board, then it is, I suggest, to try desperately to improve their lack of self-confidence in themselves, as persons and human beings. They need to identify with a certain behaviour they assume will identify and confirm their own self identity.

Me, I'm more comfortable with men who have nothing to prove to anyone in particular and respect people for being individualistic, the more so, the better. Those persons are usually the leaders, it's just nature taking it's course.

The strong eat the weak. Mercy is shown to those who can offer some kind of service.

Me, I have nothing to prove to anyone, but myself. I'm my harshest critic. I consider being the best as a starting point.

Or, as G. H. Hardy is reputed to have said... "there is no point in being part of the majority. By definition, there are already enough people to do that".

I am, definitely, not part of the majority... so I find humanity, in general, anything from frustrating to amusing to downright annoying, at times.

I took my frustration out by writing it all out in a book which you can download and read for free, online, or in your own computer.

Go to http://TheShapeOfGod.com

Well... back to my own private rat race.



Butch

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"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go"
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Postby matinee » Sat Feb 14, 2009 1:33 am

Cloudy, you are wasting your time. He won't get it.
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Postby masculinity » Sat Feb 14, 2009 3:53 am

cloudy wrote:And the 2 closest friends I have are women. My male friends are all straight, but they know I'm gay.

If you're gay, then why don't you hang out with other gays, why don't you have gay friends instead of straight friends... what is the point of dividing males on the basis of sexuality if people don't relate with the group they are aligned as per their 'sexual orientation' (so-called).

If you're one of the straights genderwise (i.e. masculine gendered), then why can't you like men being a straight. Who started this apartheid system of dividing males on the basis of who they like (or claim to like)? Why can't you reject this apartheid? Why do you call yourself 'gay' if you don't relate with gays? Why can't you be a straight man who likes men?

cloudy wrote:Seems to work for me.

When this anti-man (man = masculine gendered male; Queer = feminine gendered male] system works for you, it is then that one suspects your 'masculinity'. Maybe you're a masculine male with a dead/ hardened soul.

cloudy wrote:I don't really grasp why anyone who identifies with the concept that a gay man must be, somehow, ladylike, to be gay would find any interest in this site, in the first place.


(a) If you understand what it is like to be masculine gendered, and if you read my posts, you will definitely understand. The problem is, there are very few masculine gendered males in the gay community, and they all exist on the margins.

(b) Because, in non-western cultures around the world, only effeminate males who like males are considered homosexual... In fact, there is no homosexual:heterosexual divide. There are masculine males, who are supposed not to penetrated, and the effeminate males, who are assigned the sexual role of being penetrated.

And most straight men in these cultures, do like men, whether openly or secretly, depending upon the level of acceptance in the society. And that only effeminate males choose the 'gay' identity... not because they're different because of their sexual choices, but because they are different because of their feminine gender.

And things are not very different in the West. If you study the history of the origins of the concept of homosexuality, the concept of homosexuality and of homosexuals are very recent, and are based on the third gender, transgendered males who sought receptive sex openly and actively from men. These males were wrongly defined as 'men' who liked men, when they were 'third gender' who likes men.

It's a great conspiracy against men to keep regular, normal guys from being intimate from other men, for the fear of being called 'gay'. If you don't have that fear, then it is highly unlikely that you're masculine gendered, even in the West.

So, non-gay males who like men come here too... looking for others like them. Or as in my case, to bring up this issue of the dirty politics that the West is playing with men.

cloudy wrote:If such female identifying types like this board, then it is, I suggest, to try desperately to improve their lack of self-confidence in themselves, as persons and human beings. They need to identify with a certain behaviour they assume will identify and confirm their own self identity.

See, self-identity in a society is not separate from the others, from the communnity, this entire western idea of individualism is crap. We are social beings and our identities are in relation to the others.

cloudy wrote:Me, I'm more comfortable with men who have nothing to prove to anyone in particular and respect people for being individualistic, the more so, the better.

Again, you can't live in a world of your own. You claim to be masculine, yet you break yourself away from the group of masculine males and say you don't need to prove anything... even when the rest of the masculine males are staking their lives to prove stuff, just so they can be taken into the men's spaces (masculine male spaces/ straight spaces).

What kind of masculine male would do that? If you're indeed masculine, then you have made your sexual need a weakness for yourself, and decided to leave the competition, fray for manhood, and taken the 'third gender' identity, so you can live in peace. And you're very satisfied with the whole thing. Strange...

Even, if you were to take on an individualistic identity, then if you take the one which is not only built on 'third gendered', transgendered males, but even practiced primarily as such and treated and understood by the society as such -- then how can you claim to be masculine gendered.

Do you think all those straight men don't have a sexual need for men? Some have it as strong as you. But they hang on to the 'heterosexual' identity, because that is where the society has incorporated 'masculine gender'. Because, gender is more important to people than sexuality. Sexuality can be suppressed or indulged in secretly. Gender needs to be given vent to...

cloudy wrote:Those persons are usually the leaders, it's just nature taking it's course.

That is again a corrupted Western ideology. How can individulistic people
be good leaders. Only people who can relate with others, make adjustments and sacrifices for the others can be leaders... not self-seeking, individualistic, selfish people.

cloudy wrote:Me, I have nothing to prove to anyone, but myself. I'm my harshest critic. I consider being the best as a starting point.

... The West is a lonely planet.

cloudy wrote:I am, definitely, not part of the majority... so I find humanity, in general, anything from frustrating to amusing to downright annoying, at times.[/cloudy]
Masculine males are the majority, inspite of who they like. And they share one identity as 'men'. All those who break away from the masculine male identity, whether in the garb of sexuality or openly as third gender are not 'men'. They are half-males/ half-females.

cloudy wrote:I took my frustration out by writing it all out in a book which you can download and read for free, online, or in your own computer.

I think you should go and explore/ study other cultures and see that there are much better ways to live than you guys do in the West.
Gays are a different species altogether from men (and women). They're not "men who like men," they are "third gender who like men."

http://youth-masculinity.blogspot.com
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Postby masculinity » Sat Feb 14, 2009 3:54 am

matinee wrote:Cloudy, you are wasting your time. He won't get it.

Do you get it?
Gays are a different species altogether from men (and women). They're not "men who like men," they are "third gender who like men."

http://youth-masculinity.blogspot.com
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Re: Looking for books to help me deprogram

Postby Tom » Fri Nov 23, 2012 2:22 pm

What masculinity says is perhaps right but it needs some more validation.
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