Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

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Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby Schlodesss » Sun Oct 25, 2009 8:52 am

I'm not sure where I start, and I apologize now for length...

I guess i'll start around 1999 when I decided to start coming out. For the most part it wasn't too bad, there was the odd person who I had known for a long time, that bailed because of it, it seemed at the time like everyone was fine with it, and nothing had really changed in the friendships. But now, I talk to maybe 1-2 of the people I used to be close with and basically found new friends {Scones, Derrek,] to do stuff with who accepted me for who I was, because the others, who were "nah man yer the same dude I have always known" did infact change... I stopped getting invited to things, etc etc until the friendships kinda fizzzled out..

But while all that was happening... something was/has been going on inside me. It's really hard to put into words. The last sexual experience I have had with a man was in 2005... progressively as time as has passed since then or a little before, I have fallen back into feeling deeply ashamed of myself for being gay, I have decided I will not ever come out at work again. I learned all to well what that gets you... and it wasn't like I was in your face about it, & i'm not someone that you can tell.. if people asked, I told the truth. It started with the OWNER of the Tim Hortons I worked at asking the staff at a X-mas party I worked, if I was dating men... AT DINNER..i'm sure it made everyone think, I mean, I had been there 7 years at that point and no girlfriend. Anyways bad things kept happening at that place and long story short.. they lost a human rights case... I hate Tim Hortons, they all make me sick, because even head office offered NO help whatsoever. Anyways..

But fast forward to now. I am having real HUGE issues accepting myself as gay or whatever... and if, say, a group of us are watching TV, and something gay comes on I tense up and prolly turn red with the embarrassment and shame I am feeling. My family doesn't care, my current close friends are ok, it's ME. I'm ashamed and it gets worse by the day.. I honestly feel like part if it is because I don't feel like I have a group I identify with... I 90% fit in with my straight buds pretty much in every way until the talk of chicks/families/etc comes up or whatever... I fit in with gay men, in the sense that I like the same sex, but honestly most of the time I feel like the common bond stops there, and I feel like I am lost and don't know who I am... or... rather a group I can belong with.. or meet people like myself.. like I am some sort of odd ball... sometimes I wonder if maybe i am NOT gay afterall??? Was it just a bad father?? Because I seem too much like my str8 buddies.. but I don't want to be with a woman, that I know... and yes, I have tried looking for gay men with similar interests.. Motocross riding, automotive, etc, and it's a needle in a haystack, BUT when you flip it to a straight man, they are a dime a dozen.... and 90% my type to boot and I find I get along with them real well, even as buds..

WHY IS THIS? Maybe if I at least had an answer that made sense as to why it's such a polarized difference when you look at straight men and what they like hobby wise and gay men and their hobbies... I dunno it might make some sense to me... I dunno what to do about the shame/guilt part.. It's gotten so bad, that I would never bring someone home [and I have before] and can't ever imagine something like a marriage ceremony or... Like, really, before I came out, I was more scared, than I was ashamed... then I came out, weeded out the assholes, and that's fine, but this huge guilt and shame has shown up and I... well.. I jus dunno... I can't even exlplain why I am ashamed.. I just am. I think some of it may be the circles of people I hang with, I notice if they don't like something, "Thats fuking GAY" or call each other faggots, and even use it in hostile terms, so it;s conditioned me to be ashamed of myself, but, if I want to do the hobbies I enjoy where else can I go.. homosexuals? Ha.. i've tried. I'm sorry for the length, it's just really been eating me up inside lately, to the point of... well.... anyway.

& BTW, i've said this before, there is a backlash coming from younger guys/gals aged 14-about 28 or so, alot of them seriously do NOT like gays.
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby nimby » Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:06 am

Dude, I am speechless. I don't know what to say except I know exactly how you feel. You spoke my mind exactly.

I'm not 100% gay cause I still like women and love my wife, but I've recently been "told" by other bisexuals that I'm not really bi cause I want an emotional attachment to men too instead of just same sex sex (what ?). Just know that you are so not alone. I too am trying to figure out where I fit in in this world. It seems that not many at all are willing to accept me for who I am either. Some times I just feel so alone.

What a confusing place us people have created with the use of labels. I know what I want, but just trying to find someone who thinks the same is, like you said, a needle in a haystack.

Schlo, just take a big hug hug from me and know that my thoughs are with you today. And others like us too. I wish there was a place, a community where we could all gather and just be us and not have to worry what others label us.

Cheers
Mike
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby Rico » Sun Oct 25, 2009 2:24 pm

Thanks for the great post. I think the feelings you describe are shared by many, especially here. I can only tell you what seems to have worked for me.

The first step is to accept yourself no matter who or what you are. Abandon all of the labels entirely and you will thrive in your uniqueness. Isn't it amazing that we readily accept the fact that fingerprints are unique among humans, yet we are reluctant to accept the equally true fact that each one of us in our entirety is just as unique?

The second step is to stop trying to spend so much time with people like you. That's a social club. Instead, spend time with people who like you. Once you find people who like you for whom and what you are, then you will have found real and long-lasting relationships. I know that may sound corny, but it's more difficult to do than you think. Sure, my partner and I share interests in common, but we are so different in so many ways that sometimes I wonder how it works at all.

And finally, as far as being out at work or in the community, that's never been important to me. It's almost as if everything is already understood. The people close to me must have figured it out for themselves already, or don't care. They either love me or hate me for the person I am, not for some ever-changing sexual identity. For the rest of the world, I really don't give a damn what they know or think. If somebody not so close chooses to ask or pry, I would have no hesitation whatsoever telling them simply to "F*** off!"
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby butch » Sun Oct 25, 2009 6:01 pm

If you like guys, you are gay... if it's men who turn you on, you are gay. Get over it.

If people treat you differently, they were never real friends to begin with. Get over it.

Gay guys who are into cars and all that are RARE. VERY, VERY RARE. Get over it.
Gay guys who are into hockey and baseball are very, very rare. Get over it.

Straight people are never, ever, going to understand gay people, no matter how well intentioned they are.

The older you get, the harder it is to find new friends. Get over it.

Life is hard. Get over it.

Don't try to be other people. Love yourself and learn to live with it.

Sometimes I think I'm the loneliest person on Earth. I know I'm not, but it feels like it... most of the time.

I like teenagers and guys around 19-22. I get along best with teenagers and young men. Older guys don't seem to like me much, mostly because we have NOTHING much in common. Most don't know much of anything about anything and they find me a "know it all". Guess I am a "know it all". Can't help it that I have a high IQ and an insatiable curiosity. That's just the way I am... I've done more than anyone I know, or have known, before I was even 30. Now I'm 65. I'm now a recluse. I find small enjoyments in my own interests and that's the way it is.

Life is hard... get over it. Straight guys will never understand you, particularly the car and bike crowd. That's life. Get over it.

Be proud of yourself and your achievements and don't give a damn about the many, many, many assholes who surround you. They really aren't worth the time of day. Get over it.

You are just going to have to learn to accept that you are a bit different than most. Remember the quote: "It isn't worth an intelligent person's time to be part of the majority... by definition there are already enough people to do that." About 10% of people do not fall into any specific sexual preference or identity profile. They (you) are the oddballs in life. That's just the way life is... diversity is what it's called, and it's what makes progress happen, however hard that is to believe. Be thankful if you have your health and not some horrible disease or disability.

Celebrate and be proud of your difference. If you have trouble finding anyone with whom to have sexual encounters, the only solution to that is a large city. That's a decision you have to make. Finding someone who shares your interest in cars will not likely happen. That's life. There is a lot to be said for the concept of the "gay" stereotype because, unfortunately (God help us all) IT'S TRUE.

Trust me, there are a lot of lonely people out there. You aren't the only one.
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby Schlodesss » Mon Oct 26, 2009 12:07 am

Cloudy, you are correct, and deep down I do know that. I should clarify, I don't demand to have a partner that is a car guy or whatever. It'd just be nice to meet some people I feel I sync with for a change. I just am never satisifed with something just being and I like to know why [or at least waste too much time trying to figure out] things are how they are. Getting laid just to get laid I can take it or leave it, I can't see moving to a large city for that, i'm just not a city person. I guess 10% [I don't even think it's that much] isn't a lot.
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby Earl Butz » Mon Oct 26, 2009 6:18 am

There's nothing to be ashamed about really....no one is asking you to stand up and announce your gayness to the world, are they?

I think I would wither and die in a small town, though. The people tend to be more simple minded. Rednecks. Not all, but most.

The majority are a boring lot with bad taste. eg. the Beatles :P

Lots of gay guys don't fit in with the flaming queens. That's just a boring stereotype. Be yourself.
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby Lesley R. Charles » Mon Oct 26, 2009 7:11 am

You are not alone. I go through the same issues everyday. Imagine knowing you were born in the wrong body. Never quite comfortable with the boys, fitting in with the girls better. Even my family is more accepting of the my liking guys part than the transgender part. Not knowing what to call myself sexually, straight, gay. But know that I am here for you and support you. But do try to not feel ashamed of yourself, you are a great guy. As to coming out, I too learned it is better to avoid coming out at work, so I tend to keep it to myself. Hope you had a great weekend. If you ever need someone to talk to I am here.
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby butch » Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:53 pm

Living in a small town is quite the difficult situation.

I lived in Kelowna for a while, back when it was smaller than today and there was a church on every corner. It's still very, very, very conservative (Stockwell Day's country... his constituency. For non-Canadians, imagine him to be the politician son George Bush would be proud to have).

I had some straight friends who seemed happy enough for my company, but meeting anyone gay was well nigh impossible. I did meet some young guys in the local park in summer who seemed quite happy for some, uhm, service. More often, than not, they were tourists from larger cities who were visiting with their parents and somewhat bored to tears.

Anyhow, the point of this is that I noticed on http://manhunt.net that there seems to be a small number of gay people in the Kelowna area and, were that service available back in the 70's, I would have checked some of the guys out, if only for a chat or something to see wut's wut.

You may want to check that service out and see what shows up in your neck of the woods. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Or, as Wayne Gretzky says: "you miss every shot you don't take".

And remember, stop trying to be what other people expect you to be. Be you and be proud of it... but try to be nice to people, too.

I tend to tell people to go screw themselves, but it doesn't help make people fond of me. My Mom always used to say: "If you can't say something nice, dear, it's better to say nothing at all". But I'm not my Mom.
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby ispeaktexan » Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:44 pm

I've felt lost before.
I don't fit in with any labels.


....everyone summed it up, just don't be ashamed of who you are, and if anyone gives rebuttal well then f- them. Its not their life is it? And you aren't here to please everyone.
Yeah big cities aren't too great in my opinion.
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby michaelk69 » Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:28 pm

hey schlodesss,

i've been gone awhile (anyone miss me? lol) but I suddenly felt an urge to check the board tonight - maybe I was drawn to your post somehow, who knows.

but it made me so sad, to read it. i've known you so long - a lot longer than I've known some of my close friends! And so I hate to hear that you are hurting, even if I admire your frank, clear and direct explanation. Maybe you should have been a writer, eh? :-)

Anyway, i think I used to feel like you do now. Just so . .. sad. And disappointed. And all I wanted to be was "normal" .. . I didn't need to win the Nobel Prize or go to the moon . .. all I wanted to be was "normal" . .. it seemed so little to ask. and so being denied that really felt like a kick in the teeth.

But, over time, i realized that "normal" isn't all that great, because "normal" just means "someone else's idea of what's normal" . .. it is so subjective, if you see what I mean?

And so I decided that I was just gonna be me . .. and the screeching queens that used to really sicken and bother me suddenly didn't bother me anymore, and the people who loved GW Bush didn't bother me anymore, and even the haters and racists didn't bother me anymore, because I decided just to worry about what *I* thought of me, and not what other people thought of me or my ideas or "lifestyle" . .. I didn't like everyone, so why should everyone like me?

Instead, i asked myself: am I a good and kind person? Do I enhance the lives of people around me? Am I a good friend / son / brother? THESE are the questions that matter - not whom I choose as a "life partner" or choose to have sex with. In those famous words: it really IS all about me! And being the best, kindest, most decent reliable and responsible and loyal person that I can be. And once I realized that i WAS all of those things . .. and a pretty damn cool guy, too . . . then the gay thing started seeming pretty small by comparison.

Now, one word of caution though: I achieved all that by using a sledgehammer to crack a nut. I was a mullet-wearing, Camaro-driving, braces-wearing guy in New Jersey, and I packed a bag and moved to a tiny village in France . . . OK, i wasn't on my own, I did it with a partner .. . but it was still the clean break and fresh start that I needed.

So, maybe you don't need to come to France - although you are more than welcome - but maybe you do need some kind of "big break" to shake things up a little and actually make a life for yourself? Because, for me, that is how I really got to know - and like - myself. It sounds to me like you are stuck in a real rut.

So, just my two cents, but i hope it helps :-)
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby Lesley R. Charles » Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:59 pm

Michael, I always miss you when you are gone too long. Your viewpoint is appreciated, for you are a voice of reason.
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Re: Not sure what to title this... but something has changed...

Postby nimby » Mon Nov 02, 2009 10:19 pm

^ Yeah, what she said.
"Why do we have asteroids in the hemisphere and hemmorroids in the a$$ ? "
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