Is Lesley a gay male?

Talks about guys that are nellie.

Moderators: selective_soldier, Lesley R. Charles, batty

What do you see Lesley as?

Gay Male
13
38%
Straight Female
21
62%
 
Total votes : 34

Is Lesley a gay male?

Postby Lesley R. Charles » Fri Feb 04, 2005 3:15 pm

I have decided to do a poll to see how the members of the board see me. I think it bothers me that no matter how I try to be the sex I should have been born, that just because I have the XY chromosomes that I will always be a male.
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Postby passleft » Fri Feb 04, 2005 3:29 pm

Lesley, you need to be whoever you think you are. If you say you feel you are a woman, then gosh darn it, you're a woman.

While I don't fully understand it, I would definitely like to know more about what you feel and think, so I can understand it better.

But in my mind, from reading your posts and "listening" to the information you have given us, I have no reason to believe anything other than what you feel. Who am I to tell you otherwise.

I've know a few MTF from the bars, etc. and while some did not have quite the outward feminine appearances as some woman, I've also know many woman that looked more like a man that I do.

I think your "outter shell" is just that. so I pose this question back to you (i already know the answer) who are you on the inside?
"So, other than that Mrs. Lincoln how did you like the play?"
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Postby GX » Fri Feb 04, 2005 3:51 pm

passleft wrote: I've also know many woman that looked more like a man that I do.


You're not counting drag queens into that equation are you
:lol:
Guys who look like they could be playing pro football should not be trying to stuff themselves into cocktail dresses.

And back to the topic I guess...
People like Lesley and me are kind of stuck out in lala land I guess...we're not really into the whole GLBT culture thing(at least i'm not) but we don't exactly fit in with the straight crowd being as we are. I've sort of gotten to the point where I just don't care anymore. I still will act the part of a male in public just because that's what i'm stuck with at the moment, though I will be myself in private. My bf brought it up again the other day(getting rid of my male anatomy) and I just simply told him that I didn't like it or want it. I think he's still in the denial stage. We are from two different worlds...his being that the majority of his friends are gay...and all of mine are straight.
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Postby passleft » Fri Feb 04, 2005 4:00 pm

GX wrote:
passleft wrote: I've also know many woman that looked more like a man that I do.


You're not counting drag queens into that equation are you
:lol:
Guys who look like they could be playing pro football should not be trying to stuff themselves into cocktail dresses.


LOL. no I'm not. I mean a person who was born with all the woman parts.

and realize. I'm italian, so I grew a moustache to take after my mother. LOL :lol:
"So, other than that Mrs. Lincoln how did you like the play?"
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Postby GX » Fri Feb 04, 2005 4:07 pm

I know what you mean. On the one or two outings to a gay bar that I went to with my bf most of the women were pretty butch(wearing mens cologne and clothes). A couple of them looked like boys and I wasn't sure if they were male or female.
:lol:
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Postby qwertz » Fri Feb 04, 2005 4:11 pm

The worst thing that could happen to a gay male, is being changed in a woman. So, I am sure you are not a gay male.
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Postby Noodle » Fri Feb 04, 2005 4:43 pm

I dont get it Qwertz.

Im extra dumb today LOL. Care to explain?
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Postby FuzzyScorpio » Fri Feb 04, 2005 6:31 pm

I think you are a female mentality in a genetically male body. And doesn't the mind count for more than the body in terms of one's inner self?
I *do not* understand what you are talking about, so I'm hanging up now.
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Postby michaelk69 » Fri Feb 04, 2005 8:46 pm

Lesley, speaking just for myself here, I always always think of you as a female. It never would occur to me that anything about you is male at all . . . at least, not in the limited context in which we know each other.

I think the way you write (in your posts) sounds like a female, so the 'voice' I hear when reading them is female . . always has been.

I don't know if that answers the question, but there ya go, my two cents.
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Postby Lesley R. Charles » Fri Feb 04, 2005 10:22 pm

Thanks Guys and Gals.

I just wanted feedback, because sometimes, I just get so frustrated. Michael, it is funny how you say that but I tried this writing gender genie, and it says that I am female because of the way I write. I see myself as a female and that was how I voted. Passleft, I have a thread here where you can ask me a question regarding transgenderism and I will answer it from my point of view. It is like GX said we don't quite fit in the gay community but we don't fit in the straight community either. As always your opinions are valuable to me. It gives me an idea of how I present myself to others. The other day I was in guy mode and at the drink machine at work this customer greeted me by name and knew I was male but by the time we went to the register he slipped and called me ma'am before correcting himself.
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Postby Lesley R. Charles » Fri Feb 04, 2005 11:22 pm

FuzzyScorpio wrote:I think you are a female mentality in a genetically male body. And doesn't the mind count for more than the body in terms of one's inner self?

Fuzzy, your right. But to some people they go by genitals and chromosomes. For example, I may decide to go on female hormones, but not have the surgery so legally I would still be a male. That is how I would have to travel and if I was sent to prison it would be a male prison.
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Postby ChunkJGZX » Sat Feb 05, 2005 12:40 am

Well, how about a separate option? Does it undermine how you "feel" inside if we consider you neither a gay male nor a straight female? I don't really give you all of the qualities attributed to either column. I think in a perfect world, you could simply erase the fact that you were ever born a man and be born anew as a woman--but even once everything's as physically altered as it can be, you'll still have been born a woman in a man's body.

Is the "transgendered" option an acceptable one? Wouldn't it be okay for someone to think of you as a transgendered woman, or would you feel that it undermined your femininity to consider you that?
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Postby scguy » Sat Feb 05, 2005 3:03 am

Noodle wrote:I dont get it Qwertz.

Im extra dumb today LOL. Care to explain?


LOL...PB, I think I can explain what he meant by that. I believe what he is saying is we as gay men love our appendage,it's our most favorite toy in all the world, and wouldn't ever dream of giving it up. :shock:
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Postby Lesley R. Charles » Sat Feb 05, 2005 5:53 am

ChunkJGZX wrote:Well, how about a separate option? Does it undermine how you "feel" inside if we consider you neither a gay male nor a straight female? I don't really give you all of the qualities attributed to either column. I think in a perfect world, you could simply erase the fact that you were ever born a man and be born anew as a woman--but even once everything's as physically altered as it can be, you'll still have been born a woman in a man's body.

Is the "transgendered" option an acceptable one? Wouldn't it be okay for someone to think of you as a transgendered woman, or would you feel that it undermined your femininity to consider you that?

Thanks Chunk, I forgot that option. No it wouldn't offend me to think of me in that option. Actually it would be the most accurate way to think of me.
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Postby Lesley R. Charles » Sat Feb 05, 2005 5:55 am

scguy wrote:
Noodle wrote:I dont get it Qwertz.

Im extra dumb today LOL. Care to explain?


LOL...PB, I think I can explain what he meant by that. I believe what he is saying is we as gay men love our appendage,it's our most favorite toy in all the world, and wouldn't ever dream of giving it up. :shock:

And I am ambigious about it. If mine fell off tomorrow, I wouldn't get upset about it.
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Postby qwertz » Sat Feb 05, 2005 7:37 am

scguy wrote:
Noodle wrote:I dont get it Qwertz.

Im extra dumb today LOL. Care to explain?


LOL...PB, I think I can explain what he meant by that. I believe what he is saying is we as gay men love our appendage,it's our most favorite toy in all the world, and wouldn't ever dream of giving it up. :shock:


Yes, that is what I meaned. Favorite toy, but this also applies for str8s and they don't want to change either, although there are exceptions. If I had to choose between a miserable life as a man or a wealthy life as a woman, I still would choose for the first one. I am a gay male and wouldn't even want to change into a str8 male. No way.

A professor ethics of Ghent University (Belgium) recently proposed to let everyone choose his gender when coming of age or a little earlier. It would no longer be determined at birth by medics. There are cases of serious medical malpractice in determining sex at birth. Moreover discovering you are not in the right body during adolescence or earlier as usually is the case, would be resolved in a happier way.
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Postby Lesley R. Charles » Sat Feb 05, 2005 7:40 am

That would be great. This would be even greater for those who are born intersexed and you can't determine their sex and gender.
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Postby chrismanos » Sat Feb 05, 2005 10:05 am

Lesley, first and foremost I see you as a friend. I don't see you as a gay man, or a straight woman, I see you as someone I have grown accustomed to seeing here ont he boards.

I see you as Lesley. 'nuff said .)

Hugs babe
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Postby drtom » Sat Feb 05, 2005 1:14 pm

Lesley:

Michael, it is funny how you say that but I tried this writing gender genie, and it says that I am female because of the way I write.


Yes Lesley, if someone showed me your writing, I definitely would guess it was written by a woman. I don’t know if you saw my thread in Internal Affairs entitled "Sexual Orientation." When it comes to defining a person’s sexual orientation, psychologists believe a person’s ideal is very important. In other words, let's not just focus on where a person has been or where they are now, but let's look at where they want to be. You could have a gay man in a heterosexual marriage. If that man could arrange his life exactly the way he would want to (pretending for the moment that he is not married to a woman), would he be with a woman or another man or does the gender of his partner not really matter? I would expect the same rationale would apply to gender. Ideally you want to be a woman, so I think of you as a straight female. And nice avatar by the way!

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Postby Noodle » Sat Feb 05, 2005 1:22 pm

drtom wrote:Ideally you want to be a woman, so I think of you as a straight female. And nice avatar by the way!

Tom



Wow.

Ideally, Id like to be Denzel Washington (not really, but using for example sake) Does it make it so? Where's my Oscar party invitation?

When does " I want it real bad, so it must/hafta be true, turn into delusions?

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Postby drtom » Sat Feb 05, 2005 1:59 pm

Noodle:

Ideally, Id like to be Denzel Washington (not really, but using for example sake) Does it make it so? Where's my Oscar party invitation?

When does " I want it real bad, so it must/hafta be true, turn into delusions?


You should probably read the thread on Sexual Orientation. Most psychologists are moving in that direction. There is no where near the research on transsexuals/transgendered. So I am voicing my opinion here. Psychologically, Lesley considers herself female and she is attracted to men. I know Noodle - the body doesn't match yet and society will not consider Lesley (at this stage) a female. I think of her that way, however. This is just my personal o-p-i-n-i-o-n here, nothing more.

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Postby Noodle » Sat Feb 05, 2005 2:22 pm

gotcha.


slang for.... I understand where youre coming from
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Postby nathanjones » Sat Feb 05, 2005 2:36 pm

FuzzyScorpio wrote:I think you are a female mentality in a genetically male body. And doesn't the mind count for more than the body in terms of one's inner self?


Yep....couldn't say it better myself.

Mind over matter.

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Postby Lesley R. Charles » Sat Feb 05, 2005 9:59 pm

Chris, I am glad that you consider me a friend. Billy you are right, mind over matter. I am glad for all of your insights. I apologize but sometimes, I get absorbed into it and get a little down. Thank you for all your reassurances.
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Postby Tygrrrr » Sun Feb 06, 2005 12:18 am

Lesley, I'm not sure if I think of you as a gay man or a straight woman. :?

I will say this, I think of you as a human with one big set of balls! I don't mean the literal ones. What I'm saying is you have to the courage to be what you feel you are, and damned what society might have to say about it!

You are you, period! And I'm happy that you can be just as you are, for your sake. And for everyone's sake.
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